Curse

Luthor · Oct 31, 2005, 06:28 AM // 06:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sinjin

/not signed.

When I unlock skills/runes for my PvP toons - I do so to complete the build and character I'm working on.

When I got my 8k monk tattoos dyed black - I felt a great sense of accomplishment. It was something I was able to do only after I beat the game, collected wood and glittering dust, fought through mineral springs over 20 times to make vellum, and finally was able to get the 8k black tattoos I wanted so badly. I wasn't an easy task, and it was rewarding once it was complete.

I honestly don't feel like unlocking PvP skills/runes is an accomplishment. It's just something I do to spend my faction to try out new builds. Anyone can do it. Now getting 15k armor - that was an accomplishment for me.

ok forget this idea... i'm going to start a new thread.

lyra_song · Oct 31, 2005, 07:16 AM // 07:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by Luthor

Just to let you know, every PvP'er starts out as PvE... We know how it is... we go out of our way to cap skills for builds that people want to try out when we dont have faction to unlock it.
If a PvE'er is so worried about getting perfect mods, all the skills, and runes, then they shouldn't be crying about armor. Go get your mods.

Cant you see my point? You already have access to all those things so easily with one universal currency (being faction). If i want a great item or elite for a warrior, id need to fight high level warrior enemies. If i want a great item or elite for a monk, high level monk enemies, etc. A PvP player can just go to arena and indiscrimanately win. Killing a Warrior or Monk wont unlock specific things for you, you can use faction any way you want. Its completely flexible and compared to what PvE has to go through, very easy and simple.

I started my monk out as a PvP only. Then i deleted her and made a PvE, but i got bored with PvE as a monk and went back to PvP only. I didn't unlock many skills for her as a PvE character, in fact i only went as far as Nolani academy. The rest of my monk skills were unlocked with faction, including the monk elites that i use.

Being a PvE character means you GIVE UP all the things you unlocked.

"You have unlocked [some skill here] " So what? i cant use it on another character and I'll lose it if i decide to delete this character and have to start from scratch.

I am using the generic tattoo set on my monk because thats all a PvP player can have. Im thinking of deleting her and making a new PvE monk JUST TO GET 15k armor on her. I will lose all the skills i unlocked and have to start over before she is viable for PvP once again.

Its not as simple as having the same armor as PvE. Its a matter of incentive and reason to play. As a pvp player, your incentive should be to WIN, not to look pretty.

Supremacy Of Malice · Oct 31, 2005, 07:44 AM // 07:44

NO!!!!!!!!!
if u want beter armors u can work 4 it

NatalieD · Oct 31, 2005, 08:06 AM // 08:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by lyra_song

Its a matter of incentive and reason to play. As a pvp player, your incentive should be to WIN, not to look pretty.

Why can't I win and look pretty doing it?

Akhilleus · Oct 31, 2005, 08:18 AM // 08:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by NatalieD

I call your argument invalid because it rests on the assumption that requiring work is a good thing. I do not accept this assumption.

so you think that when you buy the game you should start off at lvl 20, max equipment 1 million gold and all skills unlocked?
GREAT IDEA!!!...
not really.

and as for whoever the person was who said that pvpers win hoh; i think you're forgetting that PvE players can also play in pvp, and a good amount of the time (if not MOST of the time) the hoh is held by GUILD teams; implying PvE involvement.

as for this statement:

Quote:

Here's another thought: a PvP character can do everything a PvE character can't. And yes it is too much work to get that armor. The thing is it shouldn't be work. I don't think many people enjoy farming. Getting it should involve dedication, but it should be fun to dedicate your time. The fact that you have the expensive armor shows that you either eBay'd some gold or you spent way too much time on a game. I think Fissure armor really would be cool on my PvP character. But I've never heard of people say they want it for close to no "work". It wouldn't take just a few minutes to set up a character, it would take a lot of time to build up faction/fame/whatever to unlock those armor sets. And for the statement you bolded: I have one PvP character. He just changes profession, armor, runes and weapons a lot. Why can't he have better-looking armor? I unlocked most of my stuff through PvE and maybe 25% from faction. Don't call us PvPers lazy.

by work i meant an investment in time.
whether it be farming or trading or whatever, it takes a lot of time to aquire fissure.
and lets say it required 200k faction to unlock fissure; i could have that in LESS than a week (hell, i could get 300k in a week, in competition arenas, and the bonuses are far lower than other pvp arenas); but if you think you can aquire appx 1.5 million gold in a week from SCRATCH, you are sadly mistaken, as its next to impossible. hell, even if you had the cash in hand, it ususlaly takes a week or more to trade for the necissary materials, and more often than not more than 1 try in fow to get to the forgemaster.
as i said, i do not object to a SEPERATE, pvp-exclusive armor, so long as the requirements are substancial, as the requirements for fissure are substancial; and only so long as its unlockable SEPERATLY (so you cant unlock it once, and make 4 characters with it).
but making fissure available in pvp serves no purpose but to demean its value among pve players, and the same could be said of my imaginary pvp-only armor if that were to be allowed in pve.
the two should be seperate, if equal. but i think in either case, consideration should be taken that a pve char takes far more time&effort to develope in the first place.

NatalieD · Oct 31, 2005, 08:27 AM // 08:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by Akhilleus

so you think that when you buy the game you should start off at lvl 20, max equipment 1 million gold and all skills unlocked?
GREAT IDEA!!!...
not really.

Actually, yeah, I'd like that. I only play PVP, so not having to bother with all the unlocking busywork would be great to me. But I recognize that a lot of people enjoy PVE, and some sacrifices have to be made to include that. So I'm not bitching about having to unlock stuff. I just want more cosmetic options for my playing, is all.

Akhilleus · Oct 31, 2005, 08:41 AM // 08:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by NatalieD

Actually, yeah, I'd like that. I only play PVP, so not having to bother with all the unlocking busywork would be great to me. But I recognize that a lot of people enjoy PVE, and some sacrifices have to be made to include that. So I'm not bitching about having to unlock stuff. I just want more cosmetic options for my playing, is all.

how much time did you take to level up your pvp char? ZERO
how much time did you take to find them your dream weapon? ZERO
how much time did you take to get the materials and gold to make thier armor? ZERO
how much time did you take to wait in mission areas, waitiung for parties, so you could advance through the game and get to the next area to aquire new skills? ZERO
how much time did you spend getting from location to location? ZERO
how much time did you spend fighting monsters? ZERO
how nuch time did you spend trading for materials, weapons, shields, runes, etc? ZERO
how much time did you spend farming for materials, weapons, shields, runes, etc? ZERO
how much time did you spend in fow, dealing with aggrotards, making multiple failed trips to the forgemaster, to have the honor of crafting the armor? ZERO

how much time did i spend doing these activities to advance my characters?
on my main warrior, 'Akhilleus Pthius' ALONE i have spent 423 hours and 47 minutes doing the above and more.
i have enjoyed most, if not all of it, but it has taken a lot of time&dedication, and you want to be able to aquire all of the benifits of a character like him; fissure armor, a perfect sword, a perfect shield, superior vigor, absorb, sword rune, etc, by spending a whole 5 minutes to develope your pvp character; the skill layout, the name, etc.
can you see why i think you're being unreasonable?

NatalieD · Oct 31, 2005, 08:43 AM // 08:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by Akhilleus

can you see why i think you're being unreasonable?

Nope.

And by the way, I'd be quite happy to leave Fissure armor as a PVE exclusive. Which you'd know if you'd been paying attention to what I write, of course, but one can't expect too much these days.

Akhilleus · Oct 31, 2005, 08:47 AM // 08:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by NatalieD

Nope.

And by the way, I'd be quite happy to leave Fissure armor as a PVE exclusive. Which you'd know if you'd been paying attention to what I write, of course, but one can't expect too much these days.

the same applies to 15k.
if you are SO heartbroken not to have access to 15k and fissure, then by all means, make a pve char and get it.
and for those who say pvp chars have nothing "special" to destinguish them, i remind you, those of us who play pve, when we make a character, they dont start at lvl 20 with maximum stat equipment,

2_fingers · Oct 31, 2005, 01:41 PM // 13:41

[QUOTE=Akhilleus]how much time did you take to level up your pvp char? ZERO
how much time did you take to find them your dream weapon? Dependant on time taken to get faction

how much time did you take to get the materials and gold to make thier armor? NA

how much time did you take to wait in mission areas, waitiung for parties, so you could advance through the game and get to the next area to aquire new skills? Same thing happens in tombs

how much time did you spend getting from location to location? NA
how much time did you spend fighting monsters? NA - Can be argued, how long do u take to fight humans?
how nuch time did you spend trading for materials, weapons, shields, runes, etc? Dependant on time taken to get faction
how much time did you spend farming for materials, weapons, shields, runes, etc? Dependant on time taken to get faction
how much time did you spend in fow, dealing with aggrotards, making multiple failed trips to the forgemaster, to have the honor of crafting the armor? NA

I've said before. If u do want to unlock nice armour, make the requirement Really really high, to put it out of reach of most players. And remove the 10k cap for faction. Should put it to 1million considering that to pvp, faction is plat.

Akhilleus · Oct 31, 2005, 09:35 PM // 21:35

[QUOTE=2_fingers]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Akhilleus

how much time did you take to level up your pvp char? ZERO
how much time did you take to find them your dream weapon? Dependant on time taken to get faction

how much time did you take to get the materials and gold to make thier armor? NA

how much time did you take to wait in mission areas, waitiung for parties, so you could advance through the game and get to the next area to aquire new skills? Same thing happens in tombs

how much time did you spend getting from location to location? NA
how much time did you spend fighting monsters? NA - Can be argued, how long do u take to fight humans?
how nuch time did you spend trading for materials, weapons, shields, runes, etc? Dependant on time taken to get faction
how much time did you spend farming for materials, weapons, shields, runes, etc? Dependant on time taken to get faction
how much time did you spend in fow, dealing with aggrotards, making multiple failed trips to the forgemaster, to have the honor of crafting the armor? NA

I've said before. If u do want to unlock nice armour, make the requirement Really really high, to put it out of reach of most players. And remove the 10k cap for faction. Should put it to 1million considering that to pvp, faction is plat.

or, like i said, simply make a seperate one, but allowing pvpers to get the same armor only has one motive behind it: to belittle pve achievements.

tomcruisejr · Oct 31, 2005, 10:42 PM // 22:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by Luthor

I just want to remind every PvE'er out there with Fissure Armor.
Us PVPer's help get back favor when we lose to Korea or Europe so PvE'ers can go back to farming in UW or FoW.
We never get any respect.
Personally I think PvE'ers need to take a step back and see how much PvP players help out PvE'ers, yet we really get nothing in return.
This fight isn't about the armor, but it's about PvE'ers want everything for themselves.
Imagine if we stopped getting favor. Wouldn't like that too much would you?
Just switch servers? Go ahead, we don't want you here if we can't get the simple respect we deserve.

LOL?

fighting for the favor was thing of the past. say BWE and early months after the release.

now its all about who's "elite" and not. so sftu.

remove the /rank emote and ill believe you.

sorry

tastegw · Nov 01, 2005, 12:55 AM // 00:55

you pver's out there crying about your pvp char not having cool looking armor do realize that you can take your pve guy into tombs and pvp with it right?

im 99% pvp player but yet i have 1 pve char in fissure armor.
explain this one fellas.
and yes i earned every peice of gold it took to get that fissure armor.

Loviatar · Nov 01, 2005, 01:33 AM // 01:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by NatalieD

Nope.

And by the way, I'd be quite happy to leave Fissure armor as a PVE exclusive. Which you'd know if you'd been paying attention to what I write, of course, but one can't expect too much these days.

i would be willing to allow pvp players 15k/fissure armor under the following conditions.

it is earned (bought) doing PVE and not faction.

and that it is specific.

specific means you get a (for example) pyromancer set for your elementalist you get only the pyro set for pvp and not a catchall catagory 15k elementalist set including geo/hydro/aero as well.

if you earn a set in the way that set was intended to be earned you should have it.

15k/fissure is a specific PVE reward but if you earn a specific set you should have it unlocked for that specific character type (any pyromancer in this case)

if you earn a full set of all types doing PVE you should have access to it.

my opinion

Draco Hunt · Nov 01, 2005, 03:34 AM // 03:34

/SIGNED

And all the PvE'ers bitching about the fact that PvP'ers are to lazy to run a PvE char shut up please. I run both PvE chars(3) and a PvP char and i find that the PvP'ers should have the same things available for them as the PvE'ers. Why u ask??¿¿?? wel because then you can make your char more personal and it ads some fun.
PvP'ers arent lazy and they deserve the same things as the PvE'ers.
And dont think that it wil be easy for them to get those armors. It also will cost them dearly. Maybe even inplement they have to purchase evry single piece of armor for evry char type there is. This wil keep it balanced. Myself have some more suggestions that also include some PvE issieus so look at them and consider them maturely.
http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...ad.php?t=67916

Draco Hunt · Nov 01, 2005, 03:40 AM // 03:40

[QUOTE=Akhilleus]

Quote:

Originally Posted by 2_fingers

or, like i said, simply make a seperate one, but allowing pvpers to get the same armor only has one motive behind it: to belittle pve achievements.

And about this. this realy makes me angry.

PvP'ers earn the favor so people can get the fissure armor. If evry one would get the same evrything is more balanced. This is not so much a fight about the armor. It's a fight beetween PvE and PvP and who is the best. Wel a wake-up call for all of you. We are all people doing the thing we do best and like best. Dont be greedy and stuborn just let evry one deserve the same things.

Goonter · Nov 01, 2005, 03:44 AM // 03:44

I agree that stylish customization should be the driving incentive for PvE playing.
If PvP premades do get improved customization, I hope that PvE characters will still vastly out shine them.

/not really signed

Heres an idea id go for though.
Say at the end of HoHs there is a crafter that crafts 15k Tombs armor for each class.
You get the rare materals for it after winning tombs matches. The materals come customized so they stay off the market.
1 rare materal for the first win, 2 for the second, etc etc. After winning Halls, say about 10 or more times, you can have the rare materals to craft the armor.
Seeing how its a crafter in a competive area, your PvP characters can have it.

See...thats a plan. Sounds like a good reason to hit up tombs too.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Akhilleus

PvP'ers earn the favor so people can get the fissure armor. If evry one would get the same evrything is more balanced. This is not so much a fight about the armor. It's a fight beetween PvE and PvP and who is the best. Wel a wake-up call for all of you. We are all people doing the thing we do best and like best. Dont be greedy and stuborn just let evry one deserve the same things.

How does a PvE only player earn fame and rank? Is it important to him? If so, what must he do to get it?
Whats better, a nice rank emote or nice fissure armor? Its really an opinion.
But there is division in some rewards to help disingush the challenges players have meet.
If a person wants to have rank they should prove themselves worthy of a particular challenge.
If a person wants to look outstanding, they must go meet the challenges set to look oustanding.

Its not a bad system at all.

2_fingers · Nov 01, 2005, 03:48 AM // 03:48

erm... I dun recall posting that. Anyway, if you do read what i've posted - i said i didnt sign it. If i was reasonable, the armour should only be unlocked when the pvp player goes thru the same ordeal that the pve guy goes thru to get his armour. What i'm saying is that put the cost for unlocking that is so ridiculously high that very few people actually would be able to get it. Only then would it be fair to the pve guys who go thru the same ordeal. Lets be fair - if they are willing to go thru the same trouble as us, let them have the armour.

NatalieD · Nov 01, 2005, 03:49 AM // 03:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by 2_fingers

or, like i said, simply make a seperate one, but allowing pvpers to get the same armor only has one motive behind it: to belittle pve achievements.

Gosh. Thanks for telling me my motive. I don't know what I would've done without you.

I couldn't care less what anyone thinks about anyone else's PVE achievements. I just want more appearance options for my PVP characters.

knives · Nov 01, 2005, 04:52 AM // 04:52

I agree.

The cost of the armor should be 10,001 faction though.